115 words / 58:21
Greg Johnson interviewed Eric Orwoll, president of a Private Membership Association called Return to the Land. Orwoll’s PMA has recently been targeted by Jewish media and activist groups such as the ADL. Listen to or download their conversation here.
Topics include:
1:00 – What is Return to the Land?
6:12 – What’s the difference between Return to the Land and Orthodox Jewish communities?
11:10 – How Orwoll and the PMA can resist the attacks against them.
19:54 – Taking advantage of the newfound publicity.
33:07 – The collapse of white social customs due to racial diversity.
49:40 – Overturning the Fair Housing Act.
51:45 – Gaining more ground, literally and figuratively.
To listen in a player, click here or below. To download, right-click the link and click “save as.”
For more information on Return to the Land and Eric Orwoll:
https://returntotheland.org/
https://www.givesendgo.com/rttl-legal-fees
https://www.givesendgo.com/aarvoll-rttl
https://x.com/Aarvoll_
https://www.youtube.com/@ericorwoll
26 comments
Unfortunately what’s legal hardly matters. Some (metaphorically) Hawaiian judge can declare it illegal and issue an emergency injunction regardless of what the law says. Nonetheless, this is an excellent project, and I’m heartened to hear how intelligent and articulate Orwoll is.
I looked into the RTTL project a year or two ago and was put off by how tiny the community was. How could such a place grow into anything significant? But given recent events, and the smear campaign in the media boosting its visibility – all press is good press in this case – I now have hope that it can be the seed of something new and influential, and it can hardly come at a better time.
Thank you, Greg, for having Eric on as a guest.
As for Kiryas Joel, I was reading about it a couple days ago and was surprised at how blatant the ethnic restrictions were. For sure there is a wink-wink aspect to it, but they didn’t limit themselves to that, at least in the early years:
“The city decreed that ‘It is forbidden for any contractor or owner of a house, in our village, to sell or rent an apartment in Kiryas Joel to a new resident without receiving permission in advance, in writing.’ Speaking later that year, Grand Rabbi Moses Teitelbaum, son of Joel, made the point more directly: ‘Anyone that rents without this permission has to be dealt with like a real murderer… and he should be torn out from the roots.’ Two residents who rented apartments without rabbinic permission were later beaten and stoned.”
The ADL crying about this being against American values is nowhere to be seen. An estimated 40,000+ people live there now, all Jews or nearly so. When we can do that, we’ll have won.
“Critics of the village cite its impact on local politics. Villagers are perceived as voting in a solid bloc… making Kiryas Joel a heavily courted swing vote for whichever politician offers Kiryas Joel the most favorable environment for continued growth.”
Keep playing your individualist game, white man…
It seems true about Halloween. At least where I lived in Washington, nobody went trick-or-treating. It seems that I and my children almost single-handedly revived the holiday in the neighborhood. Several neighbors told me wistfully about the crowds of children that used to come, and said we were the only ones now. But after we started, some others – not many – began to go out too. But it wasn’t all successful, because the existence of free candy also brought out the predators. My wife became completely discouraged and jaded about the holiday when she put a lot of effort into getting really good treats – not the usual Tootsie Roll crap – only to have a couple of black kids steal them out of her hands. It’s not the holiday, it’s the blacks, but she doesn’t want to think in those terms.
I live on a boulevard in Omaha that hosts one of the biggest and best neighborhood trick or treating spots, so much that it is nationally recognized as one of the ten best places for trick or treating in the country. Unfortunately, two years ago it became nationally known for a much worse reason, namely a dumb black guy high on cocaine that got frustrated with the boulevard being barricaded off and decided to go around and drive through the crowd. I am not exaggerating when I say this event draws hundreds if not over a thousand kids and parents and it’s a miracle that nobody was hit by him. Luckily an off duty officer was handing out candy and stopped him with six rounds in his car, three of which hit him in the jaw and shoulder.
Despite the fact that 75% of the kids I hand out candy to are black, 99% of them are respectful and say thank you. I usually go through about 4000 individual pieces of candy in about three hours. What is fucking irritating is the number of black adults who have their own bag fo dey keeid who had to stay home, which is an obvious lie.
My favorite part of the hit piece in the Daily Mail, which I heard was taken down, was the description of Mr. Orwoll. I bet it made every hormonal and healthy woman who read it have a look at him and just want to get nailed by him in a clam clubbing Viking raider abduction fantasy. He is a handsome and charming lad after all. The propagandists are very insular and their fists get ever more hammy.
Godspeed to the RTTL movement and to all such movements.
Yes, it was taken down very quickly, probably because the comments on their hit piece were too positive. (“Shut it down!”) Really lame.
Of course their description of his appearance was an attempted smear, too. They said something like how he was blond and blue-eyed just like a Nazi. But hopefully it too backfired, as you said…
Also, I liked Eric’s sense of humor in that piece. The interviewer asked if they had any members that were people of color and he said something like “Well, some of us have tans…”
ArminiusMaximus: July 8, 2025 My favorite part of the hit piece in the Daily Mail, which I heard was taken down, was the description of Mr. Orwoll... He is a handsome and charming lad after all… Godspeed to the RTTL movement and to all such movements.
—
“All such” intentional Whites-only communities are not the same, Arminius.
I listened to Greg’s interview with Mr. Orwoll aka Aulwoll and my comment on 12 July, above, was mixed. That was just my opinion as one who has had years of experience with similar communities. I never saw the earlier Daily Mail hit piece on Eric you refer to, but received this DM smear of him, published yesterday:
Leader of whites-only enclave Eric Orwoll starred in
series of livestreamed porn videos with his wife for cash
By SUSAN GREENE and JOSH BOSWELL 1 August 2025
Leader of whites-only enclave Eric Orwoll starred in series of livestreamed porn videos with his wife for cash | Daily Mail Online
Maybe this one will be taken down, too, but read for yourselves while it’s up. It’s out there and is not good. The saying, “You cannot unring a bell” comes to mind. Erik is going to need more than real estate lawyers to defend or go on offense against the ADL and friends, with their billion$ and sympathetic media kinsmen and goy collaborators.
Defamation lawsuits can be very expensive, time-consuming and difficult to win. Morris Dees, co-founder of the SPLC hate group once bragged, “the way to defeat ‘white supremacist’ groups is to tie them up in court.”
My two takeaways from the DM article:
1.) How did he manage to raise $50K in a crowdfunding scheme? I’d like to know.
2.) His big tent effort, posing as a Christian conservative, cannot take him far, as most Christians will organize with Jews to oppose him.
I don’t know details, but was told that the Arkansas Attorney General has said that what Jews (ADL) have said about Eric’s Return to the Land movement does not violate the 1968 Fair Housing Act** Hopefully, a precedent can be set for White separatists, perhaps with Donald Trump coming in on the side of majority rights and freedom of association. Who knows?
**The Fair Housing Act prohibits discrimination in the sale, rental, and financing of housing based on race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status, and disability. The act has two main purposes—prevent discrimination and reverse housing segregation. The part of the law that calls for the reversal of segregation is necessary because decades of unjust government practices have led to the presence of housing segregation today… Jurisdictions enforcing desegregation is one way to work towards a more integrated society where everyone has equal access to opportunity. Since the passage of the Fair Housing Act, people have brought many cases of housing discrimination to court and have won those legal battles.
I missed this live. And when I saw what it was about, I was disappointed. I prefer to hear Greg Johnson pontificate about current affairs. However, I was doing some chores and I am at this point conditioned to need a podcast in the background as I do that, and put this on.
This turned out to be one of the most important CC Radio episodes ever. Folks, if you have a spare tenner, you could do a hulluvualot worse than chuck these guys a few quid. I mean, you could go buy 2 frappo-faggo-latto “vanilla bullshit thing”s (to quote Larry David, everyone’s favourite Jew.) — from Starbucks who fund zionist anal rape and brutal genocide of children.
Or give it to these people who are doing something vital. We all go around in hellscape proto-Mad Max clownworld – and we think, “I wish it was the sixties, I wish I could be happy…” (to quote radiohead, everyone’s favourite pro-!DF miserablists. )
But these people are really living in a White, 50s/60s enclave right now! If you met such a person at a conference, it would surely make you reflect. How much more clown world can you take ? “One more time and I’m gonna SNAP!”, to quote Corey Taylor of Slipknot, everyone’s favourite Iowa nü-metallers.
The big point is that, natürlich, if they win a court case about segregated living, that is “YUGE”, to quite Don ZIO-te. Law is about “jurisprudence” or simply, precedents. If we set a precedent for White separation in court, that has huge knock on effects. Think about it, people!
Well done Greg on another illuminating guest (your one a few months back about crowdfunding sterility was highly enlightening also). GJ is a man of IDEAS. I do not agree with Greg on quite a few things. But please tell me what other person has the ideas, who can articulate them even half as eruditly, and who has their ear to the ground for genuine, groundbreaking ideas such as the White segregation or the sterility thing? Who else has authored books? Let alone as important as The White Nationalist Manifesto? The ideas, the ideas! Most ‘content creators’ and ‘movement ecelebs’ simply give hot takes on Current Thing [i realize i said earlier i prefe to hear Johnson on current thing. The thing is, Dr J is worth listening to. And he should 100% be allowed back on Twitter.) Greg Johnson – man of ideas. “Ideas are what drives history”, he has said multiple times. Yes, absolutely. Ideas that spiral out of control of the relatively few people who initially espouse them – and grow to become orthodoxy. But guess what, folks. These ideas get nowhere without that initial push. Look at big ideas through history- the French, American or Russian revolutions – influential art and music movements like Impressionism, or Punk – the idea of Christianity, or the idea of the Reformation.
Like a stalled car, these all needed an initial push to get going. We here, if you’re reading this, are the ones alive today to give that push. Give a push to an idea and witness it bloom into something far greater than us. This is what Johnson espouses, and this is why I continually find myself drawn to his work, for me far more than any other voice, and I’ve been following this whole movement since the start of 2015.
Don ZIO-te — everyone’s favourite president.
(Especially CNN’s).
I don’t know how my staff didn’t notice that I forgot to keep up the “everyone’s favourite X” running joke there, in proofreading. Damn Gen Z quiet quitters.
Is this the same guy as the one above? Kinda had the same reaction as a twin or triplet public prank. And yes, CC is a bastion of ideas that come as much from the comment section as the essayists. Too much of what I see elsewhere on podcasts is speaking on the same old horror stories of the day with the customary black n’ jew hatreds but little else in the way of proposals.
Good for him – he looks and sounds AMAZING. So glad to hear he has his own family with some children.
IMO – he’s going to have to finesse race and organize under something that is implicitly “White” a religious group, something like that.
I note the Mormons had Whites only, religious towns, settlements such as Navou Illinois on the Mighty Mississippi River on the Illinois side, it’s a beautiful setting I went there. Only around 300 people now live there year round, not all LDS.
I note that Orania S Africa is on a river, which makes for easier access to trade, tourism.
I’m afraid if he organizes openly as White , White nationalist he’ll bring in all the baggage of American White nationalism, Feds, SPLC, Kooks, loners. Very hard to get White women to participate, the ones who get cause more trouble, than they do having White babies.
What is this handsome, intelligent White gentleman’s region, ethnic heritage? Maybe a Dutch, Greek American, some ethnic White American others can covert to be.
It’s easier to be a proud “Greek American” than White Anglo, White German racist etc.
I was a great admirer of Jost Turner who funded Volksberg, NS Kindred. It sadly didn’t last and Jost died under mysterious circumstances at a way too young age. Jost believed in Re-incarnation so maybe he’s ~ 22 years old now. Anybody seen him.
I, on the contrary, think it’s high time we got more articulate people being explicitly and publicly pro-white. There’s not going to be a better time than now, in this brief blip where the pendulum has swung slightly right before the Democrats gain a permanent majority.
And what he’s doing is legal. Although I wouldn’t put it past some Hawaiian judge to issue a bullshit injunction, he has the legal winds in his favor, and if it had to go to the Supreme Court, there’s not likely to be a better set of judges to hear the case then we have at the moment.
The Supreme court shot down Warren Balogh’s lawsuit but the winds indeed are blowing our sails Whitewards where the deciders of society are having to now publicly acknowledge us.
A very interesting interview, and I was glad to hear that Mr. Orwoll is getting lots of legal advice and developing much practical experience.
The usual scenario has been that the Klan or somebody else like Christian Identity would put out the “Whites Only” signs at the church, the Compound, or whatever social events ─ and in doing so, if they did not get Waco’ed or Ruby Ridged outright, the Feds would be at it with the endless RICO harassment until they or some Schweinerei like the SPLC owned all the property held by the explicitly pro-White group.
That is exactly what happened in Northern Idaho with the Aryan Nations, or the Church of Jesus Christ – Christian group shortly before Pastor Richard Butler died in 2004.
I want to state that the notion that a church or a non-profit as being good innoculation against government or IRS financial harassment is very, very wrong.
It is important to do everything collectively like this upon sound legal advice. We have to understand lawfare and to be extremely vigilant about it, both actively and passively.
You mentioned the Mormons. I know quite a bit about this. If you look into it Online, the usual claim is that the LDS church was “forced” to allow the lay ordination of African Blacks in 1978 because the IRS threatened to pull the 501(C)(3) tax status of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (never officially called the Mormons). But this Liberal narrative is utter poppycock.
The Church started allowing African Black ordinations in 1978 for PR credit with shitlibs, and a similar process is going on today with LGBTQ+. The only real question is will the Church allow Lesbian Bishops in 15 years or in 50 years.
Even if that were true about the supposed IRS threat to their religious tax-exemption, the LDS Church would still require that each member in good standing gave 10 percent of their “Increase” to the Church for Tithing. The fact that the IRS lets you deduct tithing from your income taxes is irrelevant to your standing in the LDS Church, and whether you can get an annual approval from the Bishop for your Temple Recommend. (Also, the Bishop never audits your finances. If you are truly a “full Tithe payer” as you stated to your Bishop before the annual “Tithing Settlement,” that is strictly between you and God.)
And just to be clear, “Increase” is basically the profit that a businessman or farmer makes after his expenses and payroll have been paid. If you are a wage-slave, then it is easy to calculate your Increase because it is basically your Net (not Gross) wages unless you get an income tax refund, and then that would be added to your Increase.
Before I get too far afield, it is simply NOT true that the LDS never allowed Negroes to join the Church. They always did.
What the LDS did NOT do (until 1978) was allow “Blacks of African descent” to be ordained to the lay priesthood that every worthy young man does from the age of 12 (Aaronic Priesthood). And by the age of 18, or whenever most “worthy” Mormon men go on the almost-mandatory mission experience at age 19, when they are ordained to the higher Melchizedek priesthood and receive certain Temple rites, and are then called Elder.
Before 1978, the LDS were ordaining “Blacks” like Maoris as if it were South Pacific cargo cults on speed ─ as long as it was determined that they were not of “African descent.” The same was true in Bolivia or wherever.
One of the first overseas LDS Temples was built near Hamilton, New Zealand in 1958, and my roommate in college at what is now BYU-Idaho was from there.
The idea that the LDS were converting Brown South Americans en masse as though they had just discovered Hamburgers and Apple Pie, was the beginning of my doubts that the Church was operating with some kind of divine inspiration ─ but suffice it to say that I don’t think the implicit magic of Mormonism is any worse than any other Christian sect.
Even Thomas Jefferson tried to publish a version of the New Testament without the Miracles because he genuinely believed that some kind of based moral philosophy could be found in the ancient Scriptures without all the Superstition and related baggage.
I’ll leave that question to the Philosophers. My interest and training is in historiography and electronic engineering technology.
Regarding Whites-only LDS communities ─ well, places like SE Idaho that are overwhelmingly Mormon (and over 90 percent White) are still like that to some extent. Idaho is actually 15 percent Hispanic (remember “I voted for Pedro” from the 2004 movie Napoleon Dynamite?) but many of these Wetbacks would pass for White.
There are very few Negroes there even today. But I am not aware of any LDS community that has ever had any kind of Whites-only policy.
It is just that LDS communities were traditionally White, and the people who trekked across the plains with Brigham Young in 1846-47 were White and Anglo and those are the ethnicities that they sent missionaries to convert. The LDS Church focused its initial missionary efforts on the British isles and NW Europe. This is why the only three states today that are still majority-Anglo are Utah, Idaho, and Maine. The first two because they were settled by the LDS and LDS converts.
All the rest of the United States is ethnic German ─ or in Florida and the SW, a Hispanic plurality. You can also look at the most common surname in all the fifty states, and if it is not “Smith,” sometimes from an Anglicized “Schmidt,” then it is something Hispanic like “Garcia.”
The LDS movement grew out of the (Protestant) 2nd American Awakening in the early 19th century, and Joseph Smith published the Book of Mormon and founded the LDS Christian Church in 1830.
There were many associated ideas in those days like British Israelism, the idea borrowed by Christian Identity that posits that the explosion of the Anglosphere in the 18th century until WWII, is the “gathering” of the Lost Ten Tribes of Israel.
This is not entirely true because the LDS say that the “restoration of the Gospel of Jesus Christ” is from the Abrahamic birthright via the tribe of Joseph of Egypt, and not strictly the gathering of the “Lost Ten” from the Babylonian conquest (ca. 600 BCE), but these are mostly nuances rather than actual hard “doctrines.”
Also, it seems that women join charismatic churches more readily than men do, and that the early LDS Church had a problem with a gender imbalance, which led to Joseph Smith’s “revelation” that polygamy was allowed to the faithful, and also in Heaven.
JS was “sealed” to many wives, but unlike Brigham Young, he did not have a lot of children, so it seems that these were mostly “Celestial” marriages intended to provide the English common law benefits of Coverture to spinsters and widows. Every Women’s Studies course ever, has complained about Coverture as the first step in fighting the Patriarchy.
When Utah applied for Statehood (1896) the Church issued its Manifesto (1890) ending polygamy in the Earthly life, and like the Puritans of old, abandoning theocracy for the Separation of Church and State.
Mormons today are mostly Republicans but not too many years in the past, many were Democrats.
In fact, the first female Democrat National Committee Chair for George McGovern in 1972 was my Grandmother’s cousin, Jean Westwood, who was LDS and who said in her memoirs that Leftist Jewish Feminists sabotaged the South Dakota Senator’s Presidential campaign.
Not that McGovern could have won since he took an anti-Vietnam War stance which at once divided the Democratic Party ─ from the idea that the country would fight “insurgent wars” against Communism in SE Asia instead of more risky battles at Checkpoint Charlie, or the pinko ideological wars in the Hallowed Halls of Hahvahd or in the State Department (a la Joe McCarthy). The idea of Insurgent Wars to fight Communism is as Kennedyesque as it gets.
Anyway, at its peak, fewer than 30 percent of LDS ever practiced polygamy (more like 20 percent or less in my view). About 3/4 of my Pioneer ancestors are LDS, but none of them ever practiced “plural marriage.”
So, the point of all of this is that by historical circumstances, LDS communities were lily-White ─ and proselytive rather than insular like the Jews. But that is all changing now because Christianity itself is Universalist, and the LDS believe in converting the whole world for the Savior Jesus Christ.
God created the White Man and he created the Negro. Is not God and Jesus, the one-true God and the only-begotten Son, the same for All Mankind from the Thames to Timbuktu?
Well, that and my aversion to Superstition in general, is why I am not today a Christian. I would rather see children learning solid critical-thinking skills than learning Scripture.
I do feel, however, that White people have earned the right to the integrity of their personal consciences ─ so I do support Whites if they still want to be Christians, and for as long as they want to be.
This was the policy of George Lincoln Rockwell, who was an Agnostic/Atheist. But I just don’t personally see any cultural or pragmatic value in any manufactured theology.
I don’t extend that courtesy to Americans of any other non-Western group, like Islam, however. They might be good people but they mostly just need to go home.
Commander Rockwell believed that American Negroes should be given reparations in exchange for permanently renouncing their U.S. Citizenship and then being sent to Africa to collect a lifetime pension (as long as they never try to immigrate to Europe). The African countries who received them could be compensated for their trouble as well.
This would be far cheaper for us than the cancer and criminality of the Negro remaining on American soil ─ or the billions and billions of dollars in U.S. Foreign Aid sent to Israel and its neighbors in order to play nice with them.
🙂
A long and detailed post, Scott, with a lot of insider details. Are you an active Mormon? I myself have been going to the local Mormon church, even though I’m an atheist, because it’s lily white, and family-oriented, and I want a place where my children can be with other good, upstanding children (and potential future spouses), and because it reminds me of how church was when I was a kid – choir singing hymns and all that, no rock music. It’s clearly run by intelligent, dedicated men. They did a flag-raising ceremony for the 4th of July and it was beautiful: a big crowd of people, all white except for one Asian, talking and eating and socializing. Beautiful white children running around laughing, beautiful white babies… It’s like the America I grew up in, but I can only get it for a couple hours on Sunday. 🙁
But I can see in it the seeds of decline: a man with a beard dyed purple, a man with hair dyed green, and many girls and some women with hair dyed various unnatural colors. I dunno, but I think only shitlibs dye their beards purple… and shitlibs will be the death of the church. Also, the ward that meets before ours is a Spanish-language ward, and it is certainly not lily white, to any degree. Foreboding…
P.S. For the legal stuff, IIRC the RTTL movement is operated like a private member-only social club. Those have, so far, retained the right to discriminate, even against protected classes, but probably mostly because it’s been blacks, Jews, and other non-whites taking advantage of it. If white people do the same, well, we all know about the double standards. But there’s no better time to test it than now, I think.
P.P.S. You said “The Church started allowing African Black ordinations in 1978 for PR credit with shitlibs, and a similar process is going on today with LGBTQ+.” Do you mean they’re ordaining gays? I guess not yet… (I saw this headline: “Mormon Church Backs Bill Supporting Same-Sex Marriage”. What nonsense.)
Hi AM,
I have not been an active Mormon since I graduated from High School, which was 46 years ago.
I did go to and graduated from what is now called BYU-Idaho, where I studied Electronics, and I also graduated from Idaho State University, where I studied History. I should have done something different with my life, however, as I just could not stomach marrying an LDS girl, and the few non-religious ones I knew were either stoners or just too trashy for my tastes.
Anyway, when I was about thirty I asked my Bishop to remove my name from the LDS Church records ─ not because I had done anything wrong, but simply because I was not a believer, and in fact I am an Agnostic/Atheist. That was my Conscience, and I have never looked back.
Since I was my Dad’s only son, he was very disappointed that I never went on an LDS Mission when I turned 19. I joined the Army instead. But he has had lots of my nieces and nephews who have done just that and gone on LDS Missions.
I assumed that I would be effectively disowned after quitting the Church, but in fact a lot of my relatives “came out of the closet” as a result, and told me that they were basically atheists as well, except that they felt the Church is still worthwhile because of its emphasis on Family.
Most LDS are pretty much not self-aware on this in the slightest, and simply clueless that they live in a Whiteopia, and many are even affluent Libtards that pine for more “Diversity.”
I tell them that Diversity is hardly a strength; it only means less White.
Ignorance is bliss, I guess, but I just can’t personally fathom that religion is nothing besides a force of Good in the world. Assuming that religions do unalloyed Good ─ which is a dicey premise ─ if they are ultimately based on a lie about a Santa Claus in the Sky, then in my view, “thinking people” cannot in good conscience buy into what is a false foundational premise.
That is why I am not religious. I wish that I could have had long sexagenarian conversations with my 16-year-old self, and maybe I would have planned my life better than I did.
As far as the LDS Church and LGBTQ+, no they are not doing Gay ordinations. The church is currently holding a hard line against that, and not long ago they stopped supporting the Boy Scouts of America simply because that organization now refuses to discriminate against Gay scoutmasters.
At the very least, LDS members who engage in homosexual acts will be disfellowshipped, and married people who cheat on their spouses in any manner will probably be excommunicated.
The Church does not allow smoking, alcohol, premarital or extramarital sex, and it does not recognize Gay marriage. The guy who owned the apartments where I lived in college was a good Mormon who cheated on his (rather attractive) wife once with some George Michael character in the public toilets down by the river ─ got arrested, and then was excommunicated from the Church. I assume that he went back to his wife and rejoined the Church, though. Why he was tempted in the first place is just not really anything that I can understand.
In any case, the LDS Church does not now condemn homosexuals as long as they remain celibate ─ which is not a compromise that is going to work out in the long run, methinks.
Joseph Smith taught that God’s plan is about eternal progression and natural increase of family ─ whether on Earth or in Heaven ─ and homosexuality therefore has no part in it.
However, a lot of affluent and Liberal Mormons are quite butthurt about this, just as they would be if the Church discriminated against Negroes today. I don’t think it will end well.
In the end, Christians have zero standards, because they have to endlessly compromise their core principles since nobody can ultimately conjure up the special Spiritual sauce or quintessential product being sold besides mountebanks and Nietzsche’s “Afterworldsmen.”
Somehow, I think there must be more to life than what the Amish practice, which is to simply keep things dour and simple and to pridelessly “endure to the end.”
How can spirituality amount to anything but waiting for Death or waiting for Jesus if none of them can do anything without piping into the unfettered Truth with a capital T? But nobody on this Earth owns nor can tap into such a thing.
The LDS, to their credit, do not believe that their Prophets are infallible. They are supposed to be “inspired,” but they are still human beings.
People who tell us that in the end the martyred Joseph Smith “was a con-artist and a fraud” think they are really owning Mormons somehow. So the young Joseph Smith was a “treasure hunter,” etc., woop woop.
Does that make the founder of the LDS Church somehow more execrable than a pedo Catholic Priest that the Diocese protects because ─ while in their faith celibacy is supposed to be a far, far greater sacrament than marriage (or boy buggery, I presume) ─ the pragmatic fact is that there just never are enough educated Parish Priests to go around. So Father Altarboyer just gets transferred somewhere else ─ as if secrecy never did no harm, no how.
The conclusion of UCLA Professor of History Fawn M. McKay ─ who was born in Utah of poor buccolic LDS “royalty” with a name like McKay, but she married a Latvian Jew named Brodie while studying “the unbearable Whiteness of being” in Chicago ─ was, when she wrote Joseph Smith’s definitive Freudian psychobiography in 1945, that the LDS Prophet was just a treasure-seeker with a fantasy-prone personality.
Prof. Brodie also wrote psychobiographies of people like Thomas Jefferson, wherein a Mulattress slave girl named Sally figures prominently in the narrative.
But even if Joseph Smith was objectively a “con-man,” the fact is that people venerate others for their own reasons. I doubt if any Muslim ever gave a damn about the Prophet Muhammad’s eight-year-old wife.
🙂
“I just could not stomach marrying an LDS girl”
Why not? Not to pry, but part of the reason I’m going there is hopes that my daughters are more likely to find upstanding white husbands than if they just went to the public high school – and ones who will want children. But if LDS girls are deficient, maybe I’d better not have my daughters become that. (Or was it simply their religiosity that turned you off?)
“when I was about thirty I asked my Bishop to remove my name from the LDS Church records… ‘thinking people’ cannot in good conscience buy into what is a false foundational premise.”
Yes, I have difficulty with this, or something like it. I have a great aversion to lying or making false representations, and the fact is that I don’t and probably can never believe. And if I don’t believe, how can I make covenants, or even say a prayer? I’ve been asked to lead prayers a few times, but I’m not willing to fake it, so I’ve declined. I’m not even baptised. It is early days for me in the LDS Church, but I expect that at some point it will come to an impasse.
“I tell them that Diversity is hardly a strength; it only means less White.”
Exactly, and good on you for being open about it. Unless we push back, they’ll continue their march through every institution.
“a lot of affluent and Liberal Mormons are quite butthurt about [restrictions on gays]… I don’t think it will end well.”
Yes, and you can see them gradually slipping. Accepting the children of gays, then accepting gays, and then accepting gay marriage “if celibate” (yeah, right), and I even saw one church leader saying they mustn’t disobey the law and so should ordain gay marriages if the law requires it… The tone on the LDS website also seems to get more and more embarrassed about their anti-gay and anti-trans beliefs. They are not firmly and proudly held. I’m not super anti-gay, but I am against the church becoming cucked. How long before they’re flying the rainbow and trans flags and lecturing me on racism? I couldn’t stand it.
“But even if Joseph Smith was objectively a ‘con-man,’ the fact is that people venerate others for their own reasons.”
Yes, and I think he clearly was a con-man. For example, the church made the mistake of keeping the Egyptian papyri that the The Book of Abraham from The Pearl of Great Price was allegedly translated from, and we now know that they say nothing about Abraham. Of course that calls into question every other “translation”. I know too much about Mormonism to ever believe it (and you don’t have to know much to see that it’s wonky).
It’s an odd position, being a church-going atheist, but unlike many others I’m not there because of lingering ties from childhood, or any social expectation. I have no guilt over my doubt and skepticism like a lapsed believer might. I chose the Mormon church entirely for my own racist and traditionalist reasons, to provide a benefit for my children, which I repay through eagerness to volunteer for the church (as long as I don’t have to fake belief).
It’s been nice “speaking” with you.
Not related to this article but I’ve given a few ‘conspiracy’-minded people your posts on the moon landing to debunk their bland and unimpressive msm-derived claims that it was all done on a soundstage in Burbank, duuuude! Your electronics background and mind-bogglingly complex explanations that validates this ‘conspiratorial’ phenomena to a technophobic dunce like me were much appreciated but all parties whom I sent the essays on that topic to.
“Somehow, I think there must be more to life than what the Amish practice,…”.
Our goal (to begin asap) is to embark on our total racial separation breakaway civilization in perpetuity, then, head to the stars. We have to leave this planet anyway as our Sun will eventually die, also, our Solar System & beyond has limitless resources, zillions of planets, & by this exploration we will ensure our survival & our unquenchable thirst for knowledge.
XIV VERBA
How sad an upsetting to see how the Mormons treated you. I’m from Sweden and only met two once who was at a missionary in my sisters towns. They where polite but had a false gospel, I got the feeling that they preserved their bloodline and many Scandinavians had some involvement.
I am Christian but what other believes are their personal things. Like ”you believe in this and I believe in that and that is okay as long as you don’t wish me any harm or go full nuts, like Islam for example. And drink your milk.” That is, ultimately, always how we have survived in the north.
i like the initiative from the little I’ve read and will ask my husband if he can help with some funding, when someone finally does something noble. I have a weak spot for such traits.
Great talk gents and thanks for another shoutout Greg!
I’m gonna have to run back the Platonism discussion from last year.
This was a great interview. Although I have to say I’m annoyed Eric Orwoll did not post a link to the replay to his X profile. It would’ve brought some new traffic to Counter-Currents. Any ideas why he hasn’t?
Excellent interview of Eric Orwoll about his intentional White community in the Ozarks.
Eric mentioned the all-Jew community in Lakewood, NJ, when Greg asked him “how do they get away with having their own exclusively Jew communities?” Some of the answer to that question can be found here; “New Jersey: Jews Use Intimidation to “Encourage” Residents to Sell Their Homes” at nationalvanguard.org. Some anti-Jew comments under that essay are exquisite!
Listening to Mr. Orwoll I was surprised to hear him say his community is “big tent” and welcomes European pagans, White Catholics, Orthodox, agnostics, etc., and will appeal to the mainstream. That is a big tent all right. The Lakewood Hasidics may have something there with their exclusionary religious scam. I was surprised when hitting on one of Mr. Orwoll’s links, an X comment by him saying he would be willing to work with Nick Fuentes, Mr. “Christ is King” himself. I pretty much had liked what Eric had to say until I read that.
Jews have such inordinate influence in the corrupted US justice system, coupled with their control of media and the political process that AdamMil’s opening comment — Unfortunately what’s legal hardly matters — has a lot to do with how Jews “get away with it.”
When a certain Jewish “law center,” with its $700 million-plus tax-exempt war chest with which to fight White “haters,” using courts, or the ADL with its many billion$, goes after Mr. Orwoll’s Private Membership Association (PMA) as they are already doing, hoping to use the anti-White 1968 so-called Fair Housing Act, he is going to need all the help he can get from fellow Whites.
Eric recognizes and courageously speaks out that Aryans are in a war to the finish with Jewry.
It’s fortunate that comments here are not yet closed. I’d said this three months ago:
Will Williams: July 12, 2025 Excellent interview of Eric Orwoll about his intentional White community in the Ozarks…
Listening to Mr. Orwoll I was surprised to hear him say his community is “big tent” and welcomes European pagans, White Catholics, Orthodox, agnostics, etc., and will appeal to the mainstream. That is a big tent all right… I was surprised when hitting on one of Mr. Orwoll’s links, an X comment by him saying he would be willing to work with Nick Fuentes, Mr. “Christ is King” himself. I pretty much had liked what Eric had to say until I read that…
Jews have such inordinate influence in the corrupted US justice system, coupled with their control of media and the political process that… [w]hen a certain Jewish “law center,” with its $700 million-plus tax-exempt war chest with which to fight White “haters,” using courts, or the ADL with its many billion$, goes after Mr. Orwoll’s Private Membership Association (PMA) as they are already doing, hoping to use the anti-White 1968 so-called Fair Housing Act, he is going to need all the help he can get from fellow Whites.
Eric recognizes and courageously speaks out that Aryans are in a war to the finish with Jewry.
I was sincere with my positive impression of Erik Orwoll (Aarvoll) in his interview with Greg. His saying later that he’d work with the nutcase Nick “Christ is King” Fuentes was a bit alarming, as was the “big tent” approach of who would be accepted into the RTL community. To each his own. He knows what’s best for his community and I wish him and his great success. It’s good that Trump’s FBI has finally cut ties with both Jewish “hate” watch dogs, the SPLC and the ADL. See: https://whitebiocentrism.com/viewtopic.php?p=42443#p42443
However, our National Alliance’s intentional White community in Upper East Tennessee stays clear of the big tent approach with residents having various opposed ideologies, preferring that we support William Pierce’s Cosmotheist ideology as our community’s spiritual foundation.
Do not expect me to visit the Church of Israel, reportedly the largest Christian Identity headquarters, as Erik did this week. I was sent this video, saved by someone who answers to Full Verity on X: https://t.co/jnrXP7Tn6i” / X
“Aarvoll visited the Church of Israel in Missouri, one of the more enduring Christian Identity enclaves in the U.S., and [to his credit] then deleted the post. As the video began to cut out, I grabbed this short clip. The quality isn’t ideal, but the content is unmistakable [text of X post deleted].”
Curious as to what C-C may have said about CI in the past I searched and found this 2-parter by Morris van de Camp from last year: “Bo Gritz Vietnam Veteran & Military Adventurer Part 1: 1939-1986” Part 1 is interesting with a remarkable photo of Bo with his medals, but “Bo Gritz Ruby Ridge & Presidential Run Part 2: 1987-present” and the many comments under it is more informative, including this paragraph:
In the late 1990s Gritz became involved in a real estate deal in Idaho which went badly, and his wife, Claudia, left him in 1998. As a result, Gritz attempted suicide. He recovered, however, and in September 1999 he married his fourth wife, Judy Gayle Kirsch. Judy was affiliated with the Church of Israel, a congregation that is in line with the Christian Identity movement. Gritz claims that he became interested in the Church of Israel because of its dedication to celebrating the various feasts described in the Old Testament.
Always good to hear from Lucius Vorenus
This interview prompted me to check out Aarvols YouTube channel. He has a lot of interesting content there, the topic of this video in particular I thought would make a great livestream/discussion on Counter Currents.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krARJ5NJwvc
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