190 words / 1:27:01
The team was reminiscing and talking about 1990s British pop culture and what it says about the state of Britain today on the most recent broadcast of Counter-Currents Radio. Host Greg Johnson was joined by Brits Millennial Woes (official website here) and Morgoth (Substack, Odysee), as well as Counter-Currents’ resident expert on all things pop, Travis LeBlanc, for a lively discussion, and it is now available for download and online listening.
Topics discussed include:
00:03:28 Why does this topic interest Travis LeBlanc?
00:06:46 What is “Brit pop”?
00:10:03 British pop television
00:13:38 This Life and Queer as Folk
00:14:39 Ironic faux British nationalism in the ’90s
00:16:21 Dreadzone and multiracialism
00:18:34 Was electronic music seen as foreign?
00:19:13 Commercialism and sellouts
00:24:08 On the Labour Party
00:29:11 The University of Industry
00:29:47 The Manic Street Preachers
00:34:54 Greg checked out throughout the entire ’90s
00:36:56 Brit pop was made for Brits
00:49:39 Mockneyism
00:53:32 On Trainspotting
01:02:53 On Jamie Oliver
01:04:35 On Absolutely Fabulous
01:07:22 On Trainspotting 2
01:10:48 On Have I Got News for You
01:15:21 Morgoth on his naïve friend
01:20:33 Bridget Jones’s Diary
01:23:09 The geographical origins of music scenes
01:24:06 Arctic Monkeys
To listen in a player, click here or below. To download, right-click the link and click “save as.”
9 comments
I’ve never listened to one of these before, but because I love Absolutely Fabulous, (the early seasons), I tried this one. Now I’m hooked. Felt like I was in the room with you guys.
The first four seasons of AbFab are brilliant. I read it as a critique of what has come to be called neoliberalism: materialist hypercapitalism with a veneer of Leftist values and an occasional sprinkle of New Age spirituality of the con artist variety.
Agree with Suede. They were my favorite Brit pop group. Not sure The Verve were Brit pop but they had an almost perfect first album.
Never much on Oasis or Blur. Pulp and James were hit or miss but the lyrics often made no sense.
Whoa, I’m not even a third in yet, but I think it’s one of the best things you guys have ever done…
That was top notch, but something I would like to contribute is that at least in my part of the world, a big part of Brit Pop was retro. Almost more than the new music coming out, it was a rediscovery by younger generations of older British Invasion music of the parent’s generation, like the Beatles, and of course how much better that music was than most of the music of their own era. Most of the Brit Pop bands consciously emulated Beatles era music. Kula Shaker basically focused on the Indian aspects of the Beatles, like on Revolver. Melodies were actively stolen, as in the well known Bittersweet Symphony of the Verve, where they stole a Stones melody and were sued. Retro was most prominent in the clothing styles. People sought out old peacoats and Beatles era garb voraciously. Old Navy based their whole line on the retro craze.
In the US, British music is always regarded as a cut above the indigenous culture and usually in tension with the plebeian movements, which sprout out of working class milieus most of the time. In the eighties, mod type music like New Order, Depeche Mode, and the Cure was the fare of upper middle class and rich kids who preferred a clean cut image to that of the hair band and metal crowd, who generally were from the rougher parts of town. Similar with Brit Pop versus grunge in the 90s, although both those cultures were much different than the 80s.
Cant believe that Woes or Morgoth didn’t name the king of the mockneys “Danny dyer” Britain’s Aardest maaan you slags !
While in the U.K. it seems to have been properly acknowledged as a cornerstone of Britpop, The La’s eponymous 1990 album (their one and only studio record before main songwriter Lee Mavers’ neurotic implosion) is virtually unknown in the U.S., save for the song “There She Goes”. (FWIW, Noel Gallagher has cited The La’s as the greatest Britpop album of all time).
Part of the magic is Steve Lillywhite’s incredible production. While Mavers has completely disavowed it (which totally baffles me), what Lillywhite does is fantastic. As with his other, genre-comparable, production high points (e.g., U2’s “Boy”, XTC’s “Black Sea”, Beady Eye’s “Different Gear, Still Speeding”), the sequencing of the songs, and the way the songs blend into each other, really works. The album needs to be listened to in proper song order. The music ages well and I expect it will grow in stature over time, rather than fade away.
Mavers is an odd duck and a rather tragic figure, a talented underachiever and perfectionist who has developed a Bobby Fischer-like mystique around him.
Interesting to hear the commentators talk about the Manic Street Preachers and Richey Edwards. I was a massive fan, and the lyrics/rock sounds of Generation Terrorists sucked me in as a teenager. However, years on, I do wonder how manufactured they actually were in order to push a certain far-left wing, nihilistic marxist rhetoric into the culture. This was also combined with alcohol addiction, anorexia and self-harm. They also pushed the gender agenda (song: Born A Girl).
The forming of the band was not as ‘organic’ as they made themselves out to be. It was a narrative, and a very convincing one…
Richard D. Hall did a documentary with a friend of Richey, who claims that the personality of Richey whilst he was in the band bore no resemblance to the person that he knew. It’s a fascinating few hours watch, and I think Richard D. Hall is spot-on that Richey was under some kind of mind-control, which later broke down so he had to be ‘removed’. It’s also an interesting insight into the modern music industry. Hall also surmises that Richey Edwards did not kill himself.
The Tragic Street Preachers: https://www.richplanet.net/richp_genre.php?ref=273&part=1&gen=4
Richard D. Hall also raises the subject of music industry sexual abuse, and what Richey may have had ‘to do’ to get a (very generic, basic punk-rock sounding band) signed in the 1990s. Did this band really write ‘Motorcycle Emptiness’, did they really write ‘Little Baby Nothing’, or ‘Natwest, Barclays, Midlands, Lloyds’? Or were these songs ‘pre-written’? Also, Check out the part on hand-washing (and think of the convid debacle).
There is an interview from Richey Edwards (surprisingly still online at YT) where at (07:05) where he discusses the lyrics to the song ‘Yes’, and how he ‘lost his virginity’ which basically sounds like a (gay) rape: https://youtu.be/sIf_zr8P8Wc?t=424
Finally, check out the ugly video to Little Baby Nothing, crammed with far-left symbolism. This was released 14 years ago, and where are we now…?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wM3N54avEQc
Thank you, Avalon, for the links you provided. I have absolutely zero familiarity with any of the names referenced in your comment, but I’ve just taken a fascinating little tour and found it all quite interesting.
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