1,679 words
First and foremost, I’d like to laugh at the Russia apologists who think they won something. Admittedly, a very bad situation for the Russian Federation was prevented from getting catastrophically worse. But overall, this has harmed Russia greatly and did not harm Ukraine at all.
Now let’s go over some decades-old background to these events that I don’t see covered nearly enough.
How did Yevgeny Prigozhin (hereafter Prigo) rise to power? In the early-to-mid-1990s Vladimir Putin was a humble and corrupt government official in St. Petersburg. He held several posts, including several simultaneously, including “Head of the Committee for External Relations of the Mayor’s Office,” whose responsibilities included promoting international relations and most importantly, foreign investments. What this means is that Putin was one of the single-digit number of most important men for Western and internal oligarchs to bribe in order to loot Russia in the post-Soviet era of collapse. You can do more research on Putin’s role in government in this era, but suffice to say tales and investigations of corruption abound.
Where does Prigo fit into this? At the same time Prigo was running his “catering” business, which was one of the many ways of laundering money at the time, he was also CEO of Spectrum CJSC, a company that owned several casinos and gambling-related businesses. From 1991 to 1996, Putin was serving as “Chairman of the Supervisory Board for Casinos and Gambling,” among his other posts. It is quite likely that Putin and Prigo’s friendship began via mutual corruption, with Prigo bribing Putin to look the other way as the former convicted felon shadily ran his gambling enterprises, and in return Putin using Prigo’s rapidly-growing business empire to launder the money he was making selling Russian assets to various Jewish and non-Jewish oligarchs from outside and inside Russia. Now, you don’t have to be a criminal mastermind to realize that if you are conducting illegal operations on behalf of a politician with great ambition, perhaps it would be wise to “keep some receipts.”
It obviously can’t be proven, but it’s possible that Prigo has blackmail on Putin from their shared corrupt practices in the 1990s, and that this is how Putin came to both trust and rely on Prigo, and why Prigo was able to wrangle so many favors from the Kremlin over the decades and rise to the position he found himself in in June 2023. It’s clear from the events of the past few days that they don’t have a deep friendship, true comradely loyalty, or a shared worldview that makes them ideological brothers struggling on behalf of a shared dream. It seems they have simply been longtime business partners who used each other for mutual advantage. Putin eventually leveraged Prigo’s business empire and criminal mentality to create a Private Military Company which acted as a hand of the Russian government in foreign policy, which benefitted Putin’s government and Prigo’s bank account. It’s been one hand washing the other for decades.
The Wagner mutiny itself was a disaster for Russia. It did not lead to a catastrophic collapse of the Russian Federation, but it nevertheless has significant consequences. To very briefly summarize the events:
After over a year of high tensions between Prigo and the Russian Ministry of Defense (MoD), Prigo claimed the Russian MoD bombed a Wagner base, resulting in dozens of casualties (but only showing a few small fires and maybe one body in a video). He said Wagner will make the next move. Wagner then captured the city of Rostov, home to 1.1 million people and the headquarters of the Russian invasion of Ukraine, surrounding it with tanks and soldiers. He then said they would march on Moscow and hang the Minister of Defense Shoigu and Chief of the General Staff Gerasimov, as well as that “Russia will have a new President soon.” Russian border troops and various military formations did not oppose the Wagner march, and stepped aside to let them pass or actively joined. Several Russian military blogger Telegram channels, with followers ranging from a few hundred thousand to over one million, voiced their support for Prigo and Wagner. Putin released an extremely passionate (angry) video calling — without naming Prigo himself, although he did name Wagner Group — the insurrectionists traitors to Russia who would be dealt with in the severest way. He also ordered Russian military and security forces to not “make a fatal and tragic mistake” by joining the mutiny and compared the situation to 1917, saying that this could have catastrophic consequences for Russia, including capitulation and humiliation. “Stab in the back,” “treason,” and “betrayal of the country” were several phrases Putin used often.
From Wagner’s march from eastern Ukraine to Rostov, and then towards Moscow, they shot down seven Russian military aircraft, according to several Russian military Telegram channels, including two very expensive electronic warfare (EW) helicopters, and killed 12 Russian pilots. Even more valuable than the EW helicopters are the lives of trained and experiences pilots. It takes a long time and lots of resources to train even one military pilot to become adequate at their job. In one day Russia lost 12 of them, making it the deadliest day for the Russian Air Force throughout the entire war. Rest assured that the costs to the Russian state don’t end there, as I guarantee the families of each pilot will get a large check from the state to not make a public deal about their family members being murdered by Russian soldiers gone rogue who are seemingly being let off without punishment.
The Russian military and security services internally did absolutely nothing to stop Wagner, except by partially bombing one section of one Wagner convoy from the air before the attacking aircraft was either shot down or forced to evade Wagner’s air defense. Specifics of casualties throughout the entire crisis are still unknown. For eight hours Wagner marched unopposed for hundreds of kilometers towards Moscow. Finally, with the military and security services preparing defenses in Moscow, and Wagner either 80 or 220 kilometers from the city depending on who you ask, Alexander Lukashenko, the President of Belarus — Belarus being Russia’s alleged satellite state — negotiated a deal whose specifics are unknown to end the mutiny.
You can buy Spencer J. Quinn’s Solzhenitsyn and the Right here.
It was an unbelievably embarrassing and destabilizing episode for the Russian Federation.
Most Westerners would hand-wave this away, because in the Western world our politicians are open whores and their reputations mean nothing. But this is a Western perspective, not a Russian or an authoritarian one. All authoritarian regimes, especially the Russian Federation, are built on the premise of strength. There’s a reason Putin releases propaganda videos of himself doing judo training, shooting guns, riding horseback bare-chested, and visiting and commanding the military. In authoritarian regimes the people’s perception of your power, of your infallibility, is at least as important as your actual power and infallibility.
Let’s use Nicolae Ceaușescu as an example. Near the end of his dictatorship, he had lost actual, real, tangible power. But it wasn’t until he appeared on his balcony and raised his hand and told/asked the crowd to be silent, and the crowd refused, that the people collectively realized he had lost his power. You can actually see the moment on his face when he realized he had lost control. Ceaușescu then fled as Bucharest openly revolted, and the revolt was crushed, although the revolution spread across Romania rapidly. Four days later he and his wife were executed, which was shown later the same day on Romanian television. What’s important to note is that the revolution did not begin until everybody collectively realized that the dictator no longer had power or a people’s mandate. It wasn’t until he was unable to silence the crowd in Bucharest that Romania’s discontent and scattered protests turned into a nation-wide revolution. To sum up, a perception of weakness of the state and dictator is death to authoritarian regimes.
This is precisely what happened in Russia on June 23–24. A private citizen was able to embarrass the state military and security apparatus, and the President was forced to make a national broadcast which he is no doubt kicking himself over and which is keeping him up at night where he had to compare the situation Russia is in today to 1917, when the government was violently overthrown and the ruling class exterminated or exiled in a years-long civil war. He also had to admit that the situation in Rostov is “difficult” and that “the civil and military administration is effectively blocked from doing their job.”
In other words, we have gone from years of “Russia is mighty” propaganda, and then almost a year and a half of “Russia is winning the full-scale invasion of Ukraine; Ukraine does not stand a chance,” to the President of Russia issuing a speech discussing the potentiality of defeat, capitulation, embarrassment, loss of territory, civil war, and other disastrous prospects. And in the end, it’s the dictator of an alleged client state that is seen as saving the day, where the Russian President, Russian military, and Russian security services failed. It was utterly embarrassing and delegitimizing.
As part of the unknown deal, Prigo is allegedly on his way to exile in Belarus. If he is not eventually executed/assassinated, then that basically verifies that he does indeed have blackmail on Putin which he promised will be released upon his death. Now of all times, the President of Russia being exposed for selling Russian assets to Western oligarchs after the collapse of the 1990s would be almost as embarrassing and delegitimizing as the Wagner mutiny. Even if he is executed or assassinated, it’s possible Prigo still had this blackmail and used it for years, but Putin was able to find a way to prevent it from being released while also killing Prigo.
In summation, on June 23-24 the Russian Federation lost several aircraft, a dozen or so experienced pilots, and unknown other casualties. But most importantly, its authoritarian regime suffered an immense blow to its most important requirement: the perception of its power.
Adapted from James A’s Rants and Presentations on Telegram
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44 comments
When some Jewish gangster got his own private army of three or four divisions with heavy weapons and equipment, than of course he wold try to seize power, when he fails now, than he will do it later. Russian elites have created the monster and do they really think it would always obey to them? But the myth of Golem explains everything.
Here I would also add that Putin in his broadcast blamed “The West” for WAGNER’s mutiny (in Russia the West now is gulity for everything), alike as he made “The West” guilty for 1917, when “Russia has lost its victory” – in the First World War, the war, which was absolutely not needed for Russia and was not in the interests of Russian people. And, well, the Russians did not win the war in 1916-1917.
There are also two another possibilities
a) this was a provocation to find out disloyal persons in military and secret services
or
b) this was disinformation, to divert attention of the possible blow-up on Zaporozhye nuclear plant.
Why do you find such explanations even remotely plausible?
Because Russia is an ASIAN country and has the history of ASIAN statehood. I am Asian, not European, that’s why I understand the Russian mentality, which the Westerners could not understand, because they still have an illusion/delusion, that when dealing with Russians they are dealing with some kind of fellow Europeans, maybe slightly different, but still Europeans. In reality they should better use their experience of dealing with Asian peoples, for example with the Chinese, here.
Option a) – because the same provocation was the attempted putsch in Türkiye in the Black July (Kara Temmuz) of 2016, when Erdoğan used the attempt to find out disloyal elements in the Army and state institutions and purge them out. So he stabilized his power, pushed all opposition to the margins, and can rule as a dictator.
Option b) – because Russia/SU/Russia has always been a DISINFORMATION STATE, where all and everything is built on lies and deceptions. And also because the Nuclear Plant in Zaporozhye is mined and could be destroyed anytime, when Russia makes such decision.
The 2016 putsch against Erdogan wasn’t done during wartime by a key military unit involved in the war. A staged coup here would be far more destabilizing. In Turkey, thousands of collaborators were jailed afterward. Let’s see what happens. If nothing, it means no traitors were smoked out.
More likely that it was an authentic coup whose supporters failed to materialize. Prigozhin got a measure of approval from regular people, but not from key military or media figures. Prigozhin must have been planning and politicking behind the scene for supporters. He must have believed he had support otherwise he would not have launched the coup. His supporters got cold feet or betrayed him forcing him to negotiate. Putin negotiated, rather than attacked, either cause Prigozhin has blackmail or because he decided that a violent conflict within Russia between rival factions of its army would exacerbate the situation.
The Soviets/Russians are experienced masters of such provocations. Just remember The Trust in 1920’s.
Anyway the scared West now will support Putin to stay on the throne, as a lesser evil, because “that Prigozhin is even worse”. In reality the regular Russian army has killed much more civilians that WAGNER, but WAGNER has so purposedly built its brutal image, that the Russian army looks better comparing with it.
Why do so many Americans think that Putin, a rather dull representative of the Sankt Petersburgh Jewish Mafia is the savior of white America? How come Prigo became Jewish only in the last 72 hours?
Thinking how crazy the Russians are, no theory can be crazy enough. As long as it explains things.
Right now Putin is threatening Europe with the nuclear destruction. My country is threatened daily with the nuclear annihilation.
Are you sure that Prigo haven’t got some warheads from Rostov na Donu? Who knows? Maybe this was the real motivation behind the plot. So it won’t be Russia threatening, but Prigo the crazy Jewish gangster. Once in Belarus, Prigo opened up recruiting centers, already (?!).
Or maybe the idiot in chief hopes he will become the good guy over night. He’s saner compared with Prigo. Isn’t it?
Partially because everything about this war is less than scrutable, which is true of most postmodern conflicts. What role does plausibility play when we cannot be sure of which hands are pulling which strings? I’m neither a Russian apologist nor a supporter of Ukraine, but I also won’t pretend to understand this “war.”
Of course you don’t. Far behind the Ukrainian trenches we can debate and set psychological traps.
Anyway, how many angels are dancing on the tip of a needle? I do need an answer.
Regarding the Soviet and post-Soviet disinformation, the Roumanian Pacepa wrote an excellent book, which is called just so “Disinformation”. It is a useful read for anyone who wants to understand the essence of Russian foreign and military policy. Of course, Pacepa can be reproached for being too explicitly sympathetic to the Jews in his book (on the other hand, he is talking about conservative Jews, not Jewish leftists). But his book is extremely informative and written clearly and easy to read. Honestly, it is the most worn out of all my books, in many places the pages had to be glued, and so on. But it shows that I have read this book so many times.
I pray for the many good men lost in this war. I pray for the many good women who will never know them as husbands and fathers, and who may be cast into a terrible and degrading life as a result. That is a tragedy.
I pray every day, for anything that de-legitimizes and de-stabilizes the GAE regime to occur that does not harm our folk.
I think we are powerless to alter these events. There are many things we can should be doing that are within our locus of control. May we all be doing them every day.
I see a lot of wishful thinking in this piece. The saga itself strikes me as confusing, like some chapter from an alt history novel. We’ll have to wait for the fog of war to settle before anyone can start making sense of what happened here, i.e. the victors getting to write history.
I’m a little surprised that a failed uprising by maybe 2 brigades of Wagner mercenaries that gained very little support would be considered that substantial Prighozin found himself being pushed aside with Shoigu’s newly formed private militia and took a stab at saving his position and maybe gaining power. Who will ever hire or trust him again? He’s now the property of Lukashenko who’d be a fool to trust him. 3/4 of the Wagners will sign contracts with the Russians, the rest will end up elsewhere. Pretending that Prighozin has something on Putin is meaningless. Prigo is in exile, Putin remains in power, for now that’s a win for Putin. And it doesn’t make one an apologist to see it that way.
Shoigu and Gerasimov are old school military men, and there has always been animosity between them and Prigozhin. They don’t see any advantage in privatizing anything, specially an army of mercenaries led by a guy with no military training. Without checking with Putin, they tried a takeover of Wagner , by asking its members to sign a contract with the Russian army. Of course Prigozhin was pissed and wanted revenge. The Russian military could have easily annihilated Wagner in a matter of days, since Wagner doesn’t have the proper hardware for such a confrontation. The reason they didn’t do it is that Wagner is a brand name, it has connections and assets in the Middle East, resources rich Africa, and other places in the world. It would have been detrimental to the long term interest of the Russian state to destroy the Wagner brand. So they declared them “outlaws and traitors”, which in their world is a compliment, and Lukashenko brokered a deal, which most likely will keep the Wagner brand alive. Putin couldn’t have publicly brokered a deal with “outlaws”, of course, that would have been detrimental to his populist image, in the eyes of his people.
Shoigu has never been a military man, either old or new.
That’s right, Shoigu has been a politician affiliated with the military (Civil Defense Troops) for decades , with a background in civil engineering,. Gerasimov spent all his life in the military. Prigozhin is a made man with a criminal background.
Shoigu was a civilian official in charge of the Ministry of Emergency Situations. His father is Tuvan and his mother is rumored to be Jewish. It was said about Shoigu that he considers himself the reincarnation of either the ancient Türkic prince Kültegin or the notorious Baron von Ungern-Sternberg.
Just a crook among others. And all these crooks are sending countless idiots to die, and suffer. For nothing!
What’s really sad, is why those thousands of people from Rostov never took a stand against the war, yet they were ready to leave their homes and flee wherever out. Standing like sheeps waiting for a train under the scorching summer sun.
Because they are much more sheeps than the Soviet people in the post-Stalin Soviet Union. The SU and its population of 1960’s-1980’s was much more sound and “normal” society with healthy disbelief to the state propaganda than the Russian population of today.
You make here the a very good definition for nationalism.
Only that I believe that it has to be a “MUST”. Times change and with them the emperor. What the emperor promised and respected today, his heirs might not.
People have died for empires since the beginning of civilization, and many willingly. There is only one truth , for the small nations around the Russian empire, “si vis pacem, para bellum”, if you want peace, prepare for war. Let the Russians denazify and demilitarize.
The non-Russian peoples should have the right for their own independence and statehood. This is not a MUST, but a POSSIBILITY and CHOICE. If someone want to have an own state, it should be guaranteed. Сaucasus, Edil-Ural, Siberia should not die for Russian imperialists. their Jewish oligarchs and Armenian propagandists.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5fmiOaDqSU
Of course. We know that.
Our problem started when USAF poured hundreds of thousands of bombs on our heads in order to save the much beloved Soviet Union.
This rags-to-riches origin story doesn’t add up, especially because he is Israelite, just like it doesn’t in America with all these NBA/NFL owners. Where does a middle-aged caterer suddenly gain combat experience, leadership and legitimacy to effectively challenge an autocracy and the entire Western World simultaneously with a loyal convict army and get away with it?
Russia really is a federation of disparate peoples and regions governed by warlords, chieftains and oligarchs, and this mutiny reaffirmed that. Like Colonel Gaddafi, Putin has had to make a series of tribal compromises over the decades in order to consolidate this fractious empire. He had to cut a deal with a notorious rebel in Chechnya who fought a brutal separatist conflict in the turbulent post-Soviet Russia, whose son is now Putin’s most loyal governor. It turned a full-scale separatist war into a depleted insurgency in the same way the Western Frontier was magically averted in WWII, not because of German superiority, but because of Vichy collaboration.
Ever since then Chechnya and the rest of the non-Russian regions have become more homogeneous and professionalized as ethnic Russians repatriate back to the Slavic heartland. That is why the entire politburo looks like an Affirmative Action workshop. Why is a half-Tuvan the defense minister, a half-Armenian the foreign minister, a Ukrainian as its leading weapons manufacturer/smuggler, a Chechen as its leading warlord, a Mischling as its leading mercenary etc?
Well, who were the first and only shock troops coming to the defense of Putin and the Russian Federation during this brief mutiny as the ethnic Russian army/civilians stood down? Chechens. The same nation Russia bombed into smithereens before Putin first arrived. It’s no different than all the nonwhites who are suddenly more pro-America than white Republicans. They know the hand that feeds them and they have a reason to keep the titular nation divided.
The current Russian state is held together by competing oligarchs primarily of Semitic origin in the same way Saudi Arabia has a Game of Thrones involving its princes. Not a month goes by without the defenestration, drowning or untimely poisoning of former communist apparatchiks who became billionaires overnight when the Cold War ended. Russia is awash with Near Abroad migrants whom the state sides with in disputes involving ethnic Slavs because it knows a fascist uprising cannot maintain the Russian Federation in its current form like it failed in the early 1990s under Slavic nationalism, no differently than the West sides with nonwhites in disputes because a WN regime will not maintain ZOG.
Yet Russia is still more independent of ZOG than any other Western country even as it is littered with Semitic oligarchs. The difference is there is real deadly check on them whereas in the West there is not despite so-called democracy. This Wagner chief rightly lives in constant fear because he actually risks his neck for his greedy aims unlike his ethnic brethren in the West who live long lives safe from any harm they cause. During the Russian Civil War Semites regularly assassinated each other (Bolshevik vs Menshevik), whereas in the West there is only a pretense of distinction between a Republican at Daily Wire and Democrat Zionist on CNN.
Yet Russia is still more independent of ZOG
The question is how strong Russia is dependent of China. Iran, for example, became an open vassal of the PRC, as also Pakistan is one. Russia still has more freedom, but it seems to be more and more dependent of Maoist regime in Peking.
@Cash Grant, Illuminating post.
Don’t you think a major difference between Russia’s multiethnic empire and America’s, is that each ethnicity in Russia, except for the Jews, has a clear homeland? Yes, many have migrated to the big cities for work, but because they have a home territory, they are more likely to leave and it’s easier to see an eventual devolution. In America, ethnicities are spread out everywhere which makes separation an exceedingly difficult prospect.
As far as Jewish influence in Russia, I understand you are saying that because the other ethnicities are more organized, they are better able to check Jewish power. However, the sheer numbers and percentages must be important. In Russia there are 165k constituting 0.1% of the total population; In USA, it’s 6m at 1.8%.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/jewish-population-by-country
It will always be ‘six million’. It could be and likely is much more than that in reality – we have no idea how many jews don’t check the census box, whether because they believe their stories of persecution and refuse to mark themselves (I know plenty of jews like this) or because they want the true number hidden. When you are embedded in the jewish professional world in America you start to realize just how off those numbers are.
Also, part-Jews make it hard to know. If you’re in the professional world, you’ll encounter a disproportionate number. Likewise, if you are in some place like New York. What do you think the true number is?
Yes and no. White America lasted for centuries as different European tribes/cultures (Upper Midwest Scandinavian, Appalachian Scots-Irish, Italian/Irish Northeast etc) because of its frontier, unpopulated areas and politics/unions (Tammany Hall). When the going gets tough the people get going. They flee to the interior (exurbia) like Russians do in many wars with scorched earth. But black blight suffices for that here to deter population growth in the cities.
German language in America (and even Russian-German in America) lasted in isolation until deep into the 20th Century, as well as entire regions of French Maine/Louisiana. The same phenomenon occurred in Russia/FSU (and many other countries they immigrated to) with the same demographics (German Mennonites, Lutherans, Catholics etc). So these same nodes of German dialects existed in America and Russia until today, with the last speakers being elderly. A lot of it was Jim Crow, but a lot of it was linguistic/religious insularity to this day like with the Amish, who are constantly expanding their ‘settlements’ or the particularism of Mormonism who unofficially carved out a homeland and an expanding corridor into neighboring states (and even Mexico).
A lot of Russian Federation minority ‘homelands’ are Leninist constructs from a policy called indigenization. The oblasts in the Russian Federation still nominally reflect many of them, like the Jewish Autonomous Oblast, Karelia, Komi etc or smaller ethnicities in sparsely-populated Siberia. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenization
So a lot of these people had no claims to these regions, but do now because they ‘grew’ into them as the ethnic Russians receded, or still don’t, yet their continued cooperation with the Federation is all but assured because their nations are protected and given nods in prominent governmental positions.
As for Jewish underrepresentation being overwhelmed by a supermajority of Russians relative to America…I don’t think so. Numbers do not matter because Jews are still extremely wealthy in Russia relative to Russians. There are few Jews and few religious Christians in the UK yet they exert even more power over the British than they do over Americans. The writ of Zionism does not extend into Russia. Its Middle East geopolitics directly conflict – all of Russia’s allies are Israel’s adversaries. So these Zionist oligarchs really are just reduced to ‘individualism.’ Even Aliyah organizations are being restricted because Russia is accusing Israel of spying on its citizens and encouraging emigration.
In some ways Russia is ‘freer’ than the West right now. No American soldier could sound off like Prighozen has against his superiors without being dishonorably discharged. So there is more transparency within the Russian Deep State than the American Deep State at this moment because we see who has actual power whereas in America we have no idea.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_Russia
If this is accurate, another big difference is that each non-Russian ethnicity in Russia constitutes a tiny portion. In America, you have bigger groups, namely Whites, Latinos, Blacks, Indians, Jews, East Asians, Amerindians. Maybe some of those could be broken down further (e.g. East Asians: Korean, Chinese, Japanese) but not much more. I don’t know, maybe in Russia you have broad groups as well such as Turkic, Caucasian?
Good point about Britain, but I can’t help but believe that absolute numbers and percentages must be important. I state both, since political influence is likely not linear. Political power isn’t only a function of money. You also need operatives (e.g. journalists, business people, bureaucrats). A lot can be bought, but I surmise you also need true believers. You could adduce Australia as another example. But both Britian and Australia are under America’s political and cultural influence so what see might be partially derivative of Jewish power in America rather than homegrown. Another interesting contrast is that the Jewish population in Russia has been massively declining. Wikipedia puts it at only 82k for 2021! In the West, I think it’s been pretty stable.
Correct. There’s only so much I can post here without punishing a book that hardly ever makes it past the mods. Power and influence is not just money, but most of it is. So many media outlets are unprofitable and rely on subsidies from billionaire sponsors. The way International J works is kind of like Matryoshka dolls. The American Empire steers Europe, while being steered itself by ZOG. But that still makes my point because the tiny J population of London is basically just a satrapy of ZOG. It doesn’t take much of a footprint to fall under their writ. I’m not sure if the entire European Union project itself is controlled and invented by America or if it is legitimate. Perhaps a mix. I do know individual policies like Holocaust denial imprisonment is absolutely an American creation because it was part of denazification spearheaded by American occupation. Germany is still occupied to this day by hundreds of thousands of American soldiers all these decades later trying centenarian Axis veterans, which itself is almost proof that a Holocaust could have happened since they use the same apparatus on their own citizens at the behest of America. These countries are forced to bomb their own pipelines to keep a war going or arrest their truckers for protesting when America gives the signal.
The number of Js in Russia is somewhat misleading. I believe it is far higher. The latest census has way more ‘no ethnicity given’ this time. If it were true, nearly all of them have already made Aliyah since the war broke out just after the 2021 census was released months prior. But I don’t believe it because many of these ‘Olim’ are not considered Semitic enough by blood by the rabbis since most of them dug through families trees to find the magic grandparent that would give them an escape from conscription. Israel is considering changing the law to disallow Mischlinge. https://m.jpost.com/international/article-747572
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-01-02/ty-article/israeli-aliyah-minister-russian-ukrainian-arrivals-reveal-need-for-immigration-crackdown/00000185-7205-de47-afdf-f2b506d40000
Another misnomer is many of the non-Russian youths are conforming and identifying as ‘Russian’ in the same way some Hispanics identify as white.
@Kök Böri
Iran, for example, became an open vassal of the PRC, as also Pakistan is one.
What????
How did you come to this conclusion?
Where do you get your news regarding both Iran and Pakistan?
Iran and Pakistan consistently refuse to criticize and condemn China for the Chinese regime’s persecution of Qazaqs and Uighurs in East Türkestan. Not to mention the active military-technical cooperation of the Maoist regime with Iran and Pakistan.
Pakistan helps China in expanding diplomatic ties among the countries of the Muslim world, thus betraying the interests of the oppressed and genocided Türkic Muslims of East Türkestan. China also provides consistent support to Pakistan in resolving regional issues. In 2008, during the another one Pakistani-Indian confrontation, China stated that it would support Pakistan in the event of a war. China supplies equipment to Pakistan’s nuclear program and supports the development of nuclear technology in the country. Since the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, Pakistan has received extensive economic and military support from the Chinese. By doing so, China hopes to strengthen Pakistan economically and militarily as a counterweight to American and Indian influence in the region.
Since 1962, China has been a constant source of supply of military equipment to the Pakistani army, assisting in the construction of military factories, providing technological assistance and modernizing Pakistan’s existing military facilities.
(Since my days as Soviet military interpreter I remember the Chinese military aircrafts in the Pakistan Air Force).
China has provided Pakistan with equipment to advance its nuclear weapons program and has also helped build the Khushab nuclear reactor, which plays a key role in Pakistan’s plutonium production.
China is also providing technical and material support for the completion of the nuclear power plant in Chashma. In addition, China provided missile technology to the Pakistanis. All this allowed Pakistan to become a nuclear state with about 100 nuclear warheads as of 2011.
@Kök Böri
1. When Iranian political establishment sees Uyghur activists like Rebiya Kadeer fraternizing with that traitorous slime Maryam Rajavi and her murderous cult “Mojahedin e Khalq” which destabilizes Iran and murders Iranians on foreign orders, it, naturally, gets a little difficult for Iran to endorse this matter lock, stock, and barrel and resist suspicious thoughts about it.
Moreover, Uyghur appearances in places like Syria further undermined the credibility of their cause. What was their business there?
Why were they standing with Salafi terror outfits whose purpose was to weaken the territorial integrity of Syria?
Why would modern political entities that stand on the principle of mutual respect for territorial integrity voice their support for a movement that not only has secessionist tendencies but it also operates with groups that seek to overthrow legitimate, mutually recognized political mechanisms?
Until this international order of nation-states gets upset due to some massive socio-political upheaval and there is a diplomatic reconfiguration, Uyghurs will have to seek alternative ways to earn support for their cause.
2. Pakistan has been hosting hundreds of Uyghurs for decades now. A lot of them came here when Communists occupied their ancestral lands. They have lived prosperous lives. They are fluent in our national language [Urdu]. They are a law-abiding community.
Some of them did betray this hospitality and drifted towards anti-State Sunni supremacist groups and fought against the State and attempted cross-border activities, which, consequently, triggered a response from the State.
Yes, the Pakistani state doesn’t publicly raise the issue of their treatment under the Chinese via diplomatic channels. As I mentioned in the Iranian case above, it has more to do with the mechanics of international diplomacy and architecture of modern nation state.
3. As for “vassalage”, well, I am assuming you are not familiar with Urdu and study Pakistan via Anglophone news outlets. It is a mistake. You will get a fuller and more interesting picture of this relationship once you approach the affair with some proficiency in Urdu.
Nevertheless, following are some highlights:
Pakistan’s strategic behavior is such because of New Delhi’s utter lack of intellectual depth and imperial arrogance. A powerful section of the Indian political elite still imagines Delhi as the socio-political nerve center of Indian subcontinent.
Around the late 50s or early 60s, Pakistan had floated the idea of a joint front against China. Today, it sounds laughable and crazy but back then it was very much a consideration because there is more civilizational harmony between Pakistan and India than there can ever be between either India and China or Pakistan and China. Nowadays, Indian “strategic thinkers” are wargaming a “two-front” war scenario. Whenever India recovers from this state of strategic stupidity, it will have to confront this fact that in order to off balance China, it will have to approach Pakistan in a decent manner and strengthen this relationship.
Socially and culturally, Pakistan and China are very distant. The present arrangement is strictly tactical. State officials on both sides know that the societal resistance would be immense if there is an attempt to alter the parameters of this relationship and bring in it the cultural and social angle.
There is a formidable anti-Chinese/Russian faction within the Pakistani political grid. There is a power struggle taking place at this very moment.
Pakistan is heavily integrated to Western multilateral forums. The political and military elite have an extensive communication network with the West. One should not forget the massive role Pakistan in the opening of diplomatic channels between Beijing and Washington.
Regarding the nuclear program, it was only when Pakistani nuclear scientists and metallurgists had already established a strong foundation that it was possible to obtain and integrate foreign expertise. Why has North Korea not been able to build as many warheads as Pakistan? Aren’t they close to the Chinese?
In short, we know, very well, how to operate in this theatre and guard our national interests.
Regards
Still, one must say the Russkies handled this better than we would have:
https://stonetoss.com/comic/red-line/
What was their business there?
They are fighting for the freedom of Syrian Türkmenler, oppressed and genocided by Nusayris bandit dictatorship of al-Assad.
And yes, there is not such thing as “theritorial integrity of Syria”. Syria is an artficial state, created by European colonizers and imperialists after destruction of the Osman Empire, with the help of Arabian traitors, who have betrayed the Sultan and Khalif. If the Arabs do not like something they should blame only themselves (and even not Lawrence, because Lawrence was an Englishman and served his country, while they have betrayed their motherland and their legitime Monarch). The Syrian Türkmenler should have their own state, because they have nothing common with Arabs. Their lands were given by Entente to (French) Syria, only not to include them in Türkiye of Atatürk. The best way for Syria is to be parted between different religious and ethnic groups and to give them some kind of a sovereignity.
Also in Iran Güney Azərbaycan (Southern Azerbaydzhan) should get the independence and built own state with the capital in Təbriz.
@Kök Böri
1. Syria is an artificial state, created by European colonizers and imperialists after destruction of the Osman Empire…
The word “Syria” carries more historical weight than the “Republic of Turkey” and its predecessor the “Ottoman Empire” of Mr. Osman’s family. Even Ottoman atlases and cartographers referred to the region with this ancient moniker.
Of course, the contemporary political frontiers were drawn by the Imperialist occupiers but, still, that doesn’t dilute the fact that this territory has been referred to as ‘Syria’ since ancient times.
2. while they have betrayed their motherland and their legitime Monarch…
Would you also apply this rule on those Turkic tribes in Central Asia who were brutalized and occupied by Tsarist Russia from 17th or 18th century onwards? Was Tsar not their “legitimate” monarch?
3. Also in Iran Güney Azərbaycan (Southern Azerbaydzhan) should get the independence and built own state with the capital in Təbriz.
Come on. Let’s keep this exchange within the bounds of sanity and logic. “Azerbaijan” [both the Republic on the Caucasus and other Azeri speaking territories of Iran] is part and parcel of the Persian civilizational space. No amount of “Pan-Turkic” somersaults will change this arrangement.
Lastly, I bear NO ill-will towards the Turks. Wherever they reside, Turkic peoples should have a right to preserve their linguistic and ancestral heritage, and that includes China as well.
I wish them well. And I hope they do not become instruments in the hands of mischief makers.
Come on. Let’s keep this exchange within the bounds of sanity and logic. “Azerbaijan” [both the Republic on the Caucasus and other Azeri speaking territories of Iran] is part and parcel of the Persian civilizational space. No amount of “Pan-Turkic” somersaults will change this arrangement.
I rather believe your position on this matter is straining the bounds of sanity and logic. Not only have successive Azerbaijani governments within their independent state displayed a great political affinity for the Turks, the Azerbaijani languages is fundamentally Turkic and Azeri populations in Iran more genetically similar to the Turks than to their national compatriots. No somersaults required.
Settled Özbeks, for example, also belong to the Iranian civilizational circle, which does not prevent them from being Türks. Yes, Azerbaijanis live in large numbers in Iran, yes, there are many of them in the political and religious leadership of this country, but they are still not Persians and mostly do not want to become Persians. They have no less rights to their own Azerbaijani statehood than the Türkmenler in Iraq (Mosul and Kerkük) and the Türkmenler in Syria (Halep and Idlib) have the right to independence from the Arab regimes that oppress them.
@Sag
They speak a language which falls under the Turkic linguistic family but they are not racially Turks.
For instance, Kassym-Jomart Tokayev, the Kazakh President, is a Turk racially as well as linguistically. Note his features.
However, the “Turks” of the Caucasus and Asia Minor are visibly different from the said group.
The contemporary “Republic of Türkiye” comprises of folk with considerable Greco-Roman ancestry who embraced Islam and adopted a Turkish dialect. Essentially, it is a Greece that is Muslim.
The word Syria does not matter here. Ancient Syrians were not Arabs. The Arabs should better get away from the whole Sham and go back to their Yemen and sit on the palms there. And first at all they should leave Türkmenler in the Türkish parts of Iraq and Syria alone. If they do not like it they always can thank Lawrence and their own traitors of 1916 for this situation. And, no, Türks would not “liberate” Qüdus for them. We have our own tasks, and only Türkish blood and race of our ancestors matters, no religion and even no language.
***
For instance, Kassym-Jomart Tokayev, the Kazakh President, is a Turk racially as well as linguistically. Note his features.
Yes, our Qazaq brothers have some Mongoloid traces, but those features are not originally Türkic, but emerged after the mixing with Mongol peoples, like Mangyts, Jongars/Oyrats/Qalmuks.
I think you know the name of the great Mamluk Sultan of Misir, Beybars Baba. He was a Qipchak by origin, and his only one eye was blue. Before the mixing with Mongols all we Qipchaks were Europeoids, and even now those of us, which live in the Western part of the Steppe, in the Northern Caucasus, on the Qoban River, are “Caucasians”, while those who live further to the East have more Mongoloid features.
And here I speak only about Qipchaks, but the another Türkic branch, the Oğuzlar, who are direct ancestors of Anatolian, Azeri, Qirim, Bosnian, Gagauz, Türkmen and another Western Türks were and mostly still are simply Caucasians almost without Mongolian features.
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