Counter-Currents Radio Podcast No. 236
The Alt-Lite Civil War, YouTube Wasn’t Broken, Anti-Censorship Legislation

5 comments

1. On Lauren... says:

   June 15, 2019 at 1:15 am

   The gentlemen on this podcast claims that Lauren Southern was being defamed. Totally private things aside (I sort of agree with that bit, though not fully), there were several very damning critiques of her conduct that aren’t related to intimate life and reveal her as a bad actor, nonetheles. And, as far as I know, incotrovertible proof has been produced. Not that Milo is worthy of much respect, eiher, but if something is thae case – it is the case. Whether he was revengeful towards them or not is beside the point. He may inflate things, but it doesn’t seem quite so underserved.

   Having dealings with Hope not Hate, of all people – herself personally? (not spekaing about being caught up in the middle of them and these two fellows. Also, egging these guys on, in their despicable behaviour? (I have no pity for Tommy Robinson, but for his working-class donors).
   She wass complacent in the whole business of utterly scandalous behaviour of tipping the enemy off as to the whereabouts of pepole and beinh friends with some of the greatest enemy of their audiences and associates. All that she knew. How is all this not reprehensible, to say the least?

   As I said above, it’s sort of not striclly relevant how she got the material (narrative) for her documentaries, but I cannot go past the fact that she took all that money to produce something (the Borderless documentary) that obfuscates the real problems this creates (let alone speaking of the causes).Poor migrants, this or that. Nothing about population replacement at all. She doesn’t have to point fingers or say names etc, but if you don’t mention what the problem actually is in the most general (and safe) terms, then you are an unworthy journalist that tries to obfuscate matters. Eve if she didn’t defraud anyone i a legally financial sense, public figures should be judged on their works. Misleading the public like that, coupled with the contacts she had…you just can’t blame people for taking a dislike towards her.
   And no, no one expect her to be W. L. Pierce-tier. That seems like a bit of a strawman.

2. Traddles says:

   June 15, 2019 at 5:50 am

   Thank you so much for these thoughtful, piercing discussions. The following points are a few which stood out for me in the discussion about Youtube censorship:

   “The horror of being exposed to different viewpoints!” I might not have quoted this exactly, but it was Greg’s ironic characterization of how horrified the Left really is, that people might find alternative views on Youtube or elsewhere. It shows clearly that the Left do not value freedom, and they are not liberal in the old-fashioned sense.

   “These are people who feel entitled not to have their bullshit challenged.” I believe that this offers us some hope, that our Leftist establishment is so smug, bloated and lacking in self-awareness that the smallest, most hesitant challenge fills them with rage and fear. Even when our challenges are immediately shut down, we can gain some satisfaction that just our mere existence causes these reactions. As Greg says, they “feel threatened because people are thinking for themselves.”

   And Frodi said something that we can use as a succinct response when we are accused of Hate! and White Supremacy!: “I want to live among my own people and be left alone.” As Jared George has often emphasized, many of us are in this movement because of love–our love for our people and heritage, not because of hate. Hate can be a normal reaction, and a legitimate tool in our arsenal, but we need to emphasize what we love, and respond accordingly.

   I don’t want to make a list of “spoilers” with these highlights, and there are many other good elements of the discussion that I haven’t mentioned, but I must emphasize that I’m very impressed by the caliber of thought here. And it’s a very bracing, heartening discussion.

3. Theon says:

   June 15, 2019 at 6:10 am

   I listened to a podcast of Derek Black on his speaking tour a while back, and it struck me that he seemed absolutely surrounded by the usual suspects. If they were forming a barrier to his fitting in, I can somewhat understand his defection. The road of the anti-paladin is a difficult, probably a doomed one, and something every person must choose for himself. A coincidence of birth is too much to expect from anyone.

4. Fróði Midjord says:

   June 15, 2019 at 8:08 am

   Re: Lauren Southern:

   We might be talking about slightly different things, here.

   1. Details about her private life and who she might have slept with: This is none of our business.

   2. If she knew that her employees had dealings with HNH, she should ofc have fired them immediately. There is no excuse for recklessness with regard to such matters.

   3. She didn’t get to the bottom of the migrant issue in “Borderless”. All I am saying is that this is not NECESSARILY due to dishonesty or an attempt to scam followers out of their money — it is also possible that she simply doesn’t understand the topic she was making a documentary about. I have never met LS, but people I have talked to who know her have claimed that she actually IS an “alt lite” conservative, and not a white nationalist.

   My comparison to William Pierce was not a straw man. Quite frequently, when a writer or speaker doesn’t “go all the way” when talking about immigration or race relations, or whatever, some commenters on the Internet immediately jump to the conclusion that said writer or speaker is trying to mislead the audience… Well, what if that writer actually IS a silly, Christian race-denialist or a clueless conservative? Millions of such people exist, you know.

   I still haven’t seen enough evidence to support the claim that “it was all a scam.” Maybe, just maybe, some people just placed too much trust and hope in a silly girl in her early twenties, who happened to have hundreds of thousands of followers but not a clue about politics… Let’s at least be open to that possibility.

   1. On Lauren... says:

      June 16, 2019 at 3:25 pm

      Thanks, Fróði. To clarify, my main critique isn’t the conmanship, but the political detractionism in relation to us. I too am not convinced that she is all a scam or something, and I understood your (and Greg’s) attitude as weariness of the ridiculous e-thot dramas of the past. But that would be misplaced in this context, in my view. There is evidence that she knew of their doings and that she didn’t stop them. Also, I thought that she herself had dealings with Hope not Hate, but if not, I’m happy to stand corrected on it.

      Conwoman or not, it doesn’t mean that she wasn’t turned into a bad actor by other people around her, and that she has not accepted it. Not a bad actor in a a scammy way, but in a controlled-op way. I am not really buying the critique that she was always an eye candy to divert people and that’s all there ever was to her. Very often, pepole don’t start out as intentional gatekeepers, but become that with time through someone else’s doing. That’s how that sort of thing usually goes. Nevertheless, personalities like her have to be held to *some* standard. The documentary does not lead people into ethnonationalism, in my opinion, but away from it. Mentioning that they don’t have to be like some harder 3rd positionist figures a la Pierce isn’t helping the situation. She had to recognise, at some point, that things are going too far off track, that she’s been had, and that continuing that work makes her complicit. If she is unwilling or unable to do that, then she is clearly acting as our detractor, and I have no tolerance for that, whatsoever. I just don’t care enough what her actual psychology is; it really doesn’t matter. We are in such a weak position, even in comparison to alt-lite media personalities, that I have no tolerance for this or waste generosity of interpretation.

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