For those who don’t know, how did you end up creating Unite the Right?
It all came as a consequence of an exposé I did on Wes Bellamy, the Charlottesville Vice-Mayor who is pushing to tear down European-American monuments, for “reparations” policies and other anti-white nonsense. He tried to get a UVA professor fired for a Facebook post in which he compared Black Lives Matter to the KKK. In response, I dug up various anti-white tweets he’d made over the course of 5 or 6 years. This caused a big sensation which got him removed from his position on the Virginia Board of Education.
From there I went on to write a number of articles on the monuments issue, immigration and Donald Trump for outlets like VDARE, GotNews and The Daily Caller. As a consequence of my brief journalism career I traveled to locations involving stories of interest to the nationalist movement where I met people like Baked Alaska, Richard Spencer and others that ended up being speakers at Unite the Right.
It seemed to me that as a consequence of the stories I was writing on Charlottesville and the Robert E. Lee monument members of the Alt-Right decided to do the first Charlottesville demonstration on May 14th. From there I saw the kernel of an opportunity for people to put aside their factional difference and do an unprecedented, history-making rally that would draw attention to our core issues of demographic and cultural replacement symbolized by the push to demonize and remove evidence of the white European history of the United States.
You were a published author before you became an activist. What direction were you going before you got mixed up in all this? What kind of stuff were you writing?
It’s funny, this is the first time someone has asked me about this. I originally started my website to promote my creative writing and I wrote a novel (Badland Blues), a book of poetry (Midnight Road) and a collection of short stories (The Highwayman). Before I found the identitarian movement I’d become profoundly disillusioned by modernity and liberalism. It led me to a sort of nihilism that I found expressed really well by writers like Charles Bukowski and John Fante. My poetry and crime noir stories were an outlet for me to explore some existential questions that were bugging me and push the boundaries of my identity with some pretty absurd characters.
I’m trying to get at a bigger picture of who you are as a person if politics is taken out of the equation. Don’t you want to pitch your books to us to try to get more book sales, or just wax on about all the artistic angst that drove you to write?
That’s difficult to say at this point because the man and the mission have become nearly indistinguishable. I’m at war with my government and the media. It’s really consumed my life. The things that troubled my mind prior to my political mission are really irrelevant at this point. All of the energy that went into grasping at intangible problems within my own mind have been replaced by problems with real world consequence in physical reality. I think that’s the difference between trying to solve existential questions through a sort of primal scream of creative expression versus affixing your problems to the results of public policies which need to be changed through assertive action.
In my case, I don’t doubt that my life may have gone in a more apolitical direction. Perhaps if I lived in a society with more job opportunities for white male college graduates or less feminism I’d be more likely to be a married normie with a six figure paying job in a cubicle somewhere instead of dedicating my energy to radical political change. The dispossession of white males within their own societies is creating an underclass of pissed-off individuals like me, which are a necessary element of radical political change. The public policies that concern me, and I’ve turned my life over to solving, aren’t necessarily effecting me as individual so much as they’re effecting white people as a whole. In that sense I’ve moved on from a self-centered life to one given in furtherance of my community.
The last anyone listening to the mainstream media heard, Unite the Right was a disaster. One Nazi deliberately killed people in a car attack, other guys got arrested for random violence against black counter-protesters, and the whole event got shut down and no one was even allowed to speak because there was just so much wanton violence. Trump, evil bigot Nazi that he is, even dared to suggest that there were good and bad people on both sides. And for that, the press hounded him for days.
The public finally seems to be catching wind that that narrative is falling apart. Can you update us on the revelations that have come to light since August?
Unite the Right is the beginning of a necessary manifestation of pro-white online activism into the streets of America. It was a necessary learning experience for everyone involved about the shenanigans the Left is willing to go to stop pro-white ideas from reaching an unprecedented global audience.
Of course the initial narrative was outrageously false even on ostensibly conservative networks like Fox News. The unraveling of that narrative provides a golden opportunity for us because if we are successful in proving it false we effectively plant ourselves as plucky underdogs in the minds of the sympathetic public and plant serious seeds of doubt about anything the media says about us going forward.
The biggest bombshell to come out so far is a scathing 200+ page report commissioned by the city of Charlottesville and conducted by former federal prosecutor Tim Heaphy. It details how the Charlottesville government and police department failed to protect the First Amendment on every level. Charlottesville City Councilors “unduly interfered” time and time again decisions by law enforcement, even against the advice of their own attorneys.
On the day of the rally declaring an unlawful assembly was explicitly one of the objectives of the Charlottesville Police Department and the Police Chief Al Thomas was overheard by multiple witnesses saying, “Let them fight. It will make it easier to declare an unlawful assembly.” During the investigation the police chief lied about using private emails to plan the rally response, deleted text messages substantive to the investigation, and grilled subordinates about what they were telling the investigators.
This is really only the tip of the iceberg because it’s obvious that the report doesn’t delve enough into the role played by City Council, the City Manager. The state police, who were presumably given a stand-down order by Virginia Governor Terry McAuliffe didn’t cooperate with the investigation.
In the near future we’ll be filing a civil rights lawsuit against the City of Charlottesville which will allow us to unseal redacted documents and communications as well as depose the officials behind this conspiracy under oath in a court of law. I have reason to believe they’re intentionally hiding a lot more of their communications by use of private email servers and disposable burner phones.
You came to Charlottesville to give a speech. Of course, because of the way things were handled, no one ever got to hear it. What were you planning to say?
I planned to improvise a speech so that I could be present in the moment of whatever was happening at the time. I planned to hit on some of the major themes of the rally like preservation of monuments, free speech and curbing the ethnic replacement of whites in Western countries.
If our demonstrators were easily able to hear us I’d probably err more on the side of substance but if there was a lot of raucous noise from the Antifa I probably would have gone more on the side of emotion with something fusing political speech with a professional wrestling promo.
I think all of us understand at some primal level in our bones that things like flags and monuments are the way human beings mark their territory. It’s an evolution of the same behavior that makes an animal pee and sniff around for other animals’ pee. So I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Antifa brings bottles of urine to these events to sling at the people they’re protesting against, because this is really a battle over perceptions of territory. They’re acting even more “like animals” than the rest of us, but it’s obvious enough that the fight taking place is an animalistic one to some degree.
So a lot of people who showed up to fight against the removal of the monument might not even have known whose monument it was. And that certainly makes sense: many of the people who are pushing this program of monument and flag removal really want to demonize white people and Western civilization as a whole. And it’s reasonable for them to respond to that, even if they don’t know enough about a particular target these people have chosen.
With that said, it was Robert E. Lee’s statue coming down in Virginia. Do you think he’s particularly important as a symbol or an inspiration for us? Is there anything you think we could, or should be doing to help ground our movement in a better awareness of our past moving forward?
The importance of Robert E. Lee depends on your regional identity. In the South there’s really no one more iconic. Like Robert E. Lee, the South as a voting block has been a bulwark against Leftist aggression. As Marxists have taken over the reins of the Empire the memory of a man who fought back against the tyranny of his countrymen is powerfully symbolic.
That being said you don’t have to be a Southerner to appreciate Robert E. Lee or the other Confederate heroes immortalized in the monuments. They’re the vanguard protecting all the other statues of European heroes. Once the precedent is set to remove them because of “muh slavery”, it will be open season on the rest of our leaders because according to the Left our nation was “stolen” from the Native Americans.
Charlottesville was also valuable for us as a movement because it served as a kind of litmus test to see where people stand when it comes to taking action out in the real world.
To be perfectly honest, I wasn’t sure what to make of you before that. Suddenly, here this guy comes out of nowhere, and now overnight he’s organizing the largest public gathering we’ve ever had. A few people started saying some really wild stuff about you being listed as living in a psych ward three months ago, and there was a moment where I wasn’t sure what to believe.
But since then, I’ve seen you hold your ground, and I’ve seen you stay after the big flashy party is over to keep standing by your convictions and keep putting in the inglorious grunt work. Any trouble that resulted in Charlottesville, you’ve been there still fighting for your people, gathering contact information and evidence for anyone wrongly put in jail, and I’ve gained a great deal of respect for you just from watching that alone. And I’m not sure I could say the same about everyone I saw involved in the event. Can you summarize some of the work that you’ve done?
I had a lot of work to do rebuilding my standing within the movement. After August 12th I was hit by a lot of fake news attacks, some of them constructed by organizations like the SPLC and some by unseen actors (possibly government intelligence, JIDF, ADL, government crisis management firms or rivals in the movement).
In the midst of all that rebuilding I had to find a legal team to represent the various parties who attended Unite the Right. It wasn’t easy to find guys who didn’t want $400,000 just to represent us, but with the help of Matt Parrott of the Traditionalist Worker Party I was able to find a good attorney in Ohio. He’ll be representing me, TWP, Identity Europa, and a number of others. I feel like he and local counsel Elmer Woodard are going to be big assets for our legal representation well beyond the scope of just Unite the Right.
Besides that I’m continuing to give legal updates, news, and strategic advice for the movement through my website. I try to show up to every court date dealing with Charlottesville and I’m the only right-wing journalist that reports on these cases from a place of personal experience and I provide transparency for some of the high-profile cases involving Chris Cantwell, James Fields and others.
Going into 2018 I’m going to continue working on organization and unity within our movement. In most cases I really do believe in the Unite the Right project and various pro-white groups and individuals working together. We’re already outnumbered, no reason to divide our numbers with petty ideological disagreements.
As the main impetus and the basic reason why this event happened where it did, what have you learned about co-operating with other leaders in a movement like this one? The original name for the event was “Unite the Right.” Are you still convinced that that’s possible—or even that it’s desirable?
Yes, we can absolutely Unite the Right again and it is a desirable goal (see me last question). I’ve talked to most of the major parties involved in the first one and they’re excited about the opportunity to go back. Maybe everyone won’t be onboard but we don’t need that. We need an elite force of the best pro-white activists who will stand their ground on this incredibly important moment in history. People who thought this was a struggle we could win without trials and tribulations might not be the best suited.
At the end of the day everyone will go if we demonstrate how we’re going to improve upon the security aspects, why it’s a morally principled thing to do and how it will reflect upon themselves and the movement as a whole. My job between now and the time I really start promoting this (~June 2018) is to shore up these elements.
Now, bear with me for this one. Pretend you just got an interview with CNN, we’re doing this question for all the regular viewers watching TV. Handle me like you’d handle that.
What the hell’s wrong with you? Why can’t you just pack up and go home so everyone can have their peace and quiet? Why create so much hassle and chaos for yourself?
And why’s this time going to be any different than the last?
We have to do this rally on principle. We have a First Amendment right that was denied to us by the machinations of the Charlottesville government. The initial news reporting on our event was outrageously false and we have a right to stand up for white people like other races are allowed to do without threats of violence.
If we were to just slink away and never come back to Charlottesville it would show our enemies that there is a price on shutting us up. Enemy politicans may face a multi-million dollar lawsuit for violating our First Amendment rights but maybe that’s worth it to them, especially when organizations like the ADL are going to be footing the bill for their electoral ambitions and it gets them national exposure on CNN.
UTR 2 says to these Communist municipalities that if they think that’s a winning strategy they’re wrong. Not only will we sue them but we’ll also keep coming back until they allow us to speak as is our right. Besides that the new information coming out in the Heaphy report and the lawsuits would be information the media sweeps under the rug, long after the sensational event is embedded in people’s memory. Doing a second rally forces the nation to reexamine the situation and how misled they were by the Fake News media.
The presence of movement lawyers there to ensure our rights are upheld and permits that aren’t changed around 12 hours before the start of the rally will help things turn out differently. The rest is up to us to learn from and coordinate a more effective strategy. For instance, I wouldn’t recommend a last-minute decision to do another torch rally the night before. I’d also plan on picking a rally point before the rally so that everyone can enter the venue together along with police and National Guard escorts.
I’d also expect a culture shift from UTR 1 to UTR 2. We did a fantastic job of uniting various factions of the pro-white movement but the on-the-ground implementation still showed class differences which are harmful to white solidarity. In retrospect the guys that I put in charge of ground security were (unbeknownst to me) NPI/Richard Spencer employees who didn’t work well with working-class groups like the Nationalist Front. Groups outside the “white polo” factions weren’t properly included in decision-making and that led to them developing different plans and marching in separately. In my opinion, classism, elitism and centralization of power around a factional clique are anathema to uniting the right and white solidarity.
Let’s clear the air about your political history. Some people apparently think it’s damning that you voted for Obama in 2008. But Julian Langness did too, in fact he was actually the youngest Obama delegate to the DNC and now he’s authoring books and giving speeches at AmRen.
What made you lean left back then? What changed? And what are your politics now?
The main reason I used to lean left is that the left used to be less about social justice. Democrats portrayed themselves as being in favor of the working class and against stupid wars in the Middle East. During the Obama years the Cultural Marxists took over and began pushing feminism, sexual reassignment for children, and race war against white people.
I stopped believing the pseudoscientific sociological studies touted on NPR and started to believe the IQ testing and crime statistics presented on sites like 4Chan. I’m still anti-war and I still support the working class as I always have. However I realized that the true underdogs in society are the white men and women who are being dispossessed in their own countries. They critically need advocates right now. I’m not a conservative Republican in the neocon sense of valuing tax cuts, cheap foreign labor and endless war. My conservatism is a reaction to the cultural war waged on my people and their heritage.
The video I saw of you confronting the Charlottesville City Council is one of the most impressive things I’ve ever seen.
Obviously, we’re all busy trying to expose these kinds of hypocrisies and contradictions to people, and it’s not surprising to me that it exists, but it’s still amazing to me that the hypocrisy can get this blatant and these people can still not realize they’re creating our propaganda for us.
You come up and say “we have to stand up for white people” and the audience jeers and boos and hisses and a woman on the council tells you you’re “dangerously close to hate speech.”
But then these two things happen literally back to back, a black woman comes up next and starts yelling about how she doesn’t want to hear any more woe-is-me Jewish stories about the Holocaust, pointing fingers at people on the council while making death threats (“this next council meeting will be your last, don’t make it your last!”), and claiming the National Council of 100 Black Women isn’t black because, she exclaims in outrage, “the JEW in it!”
I’m pretty sure if you had said half what she did, you would have literally been arrested. As a resident of Charlottesville, when did you first see it get this bad?
Yes, absolutely. The infuriating double standards I see in my community are what got me involved politically and continue to light my fire day to day. Among City Councilor Wes Bellamy’s milder tweets he said, “White women are the devil.” If a white man had only said “Black women are the devil,” he would have been fired, ostracized and rendered unemployable by media outrage.
In the above video alone there is a civil rights lawsuit waiting to happen. They allowed the mob to shout over me for half of my time (which they didn’t give back to me) and had the police escort me out. Yet I have dozens of videos of sassy black people cursing, acting uncontrollable, shouting over others, and going well over their time limit without being silenced by the police.
This isn’t the Charlottesville I knew growing up. I grew up in a fairly conservative environment with a family that went to church, went to football games and voted for Republicans. Sure there’ve been hippies, nouveau riche lefty developers, and high-profile Democrats like Dave Matthews and John Grisham for as long as I can remember. But it wasn’t until Wes Bellamy came in and tried to take down the statue that you started getting mobs of Antifa groups like SURJ shouting down people they don’t agree and leading public harassment campaigns. Now after Unite the Right Charlottesville is Communism on steroids. Everything is race panic, condemnation of white identity, and a desperate attempt to redefine illegal immigrants, militant blacks, Muslims, and trannies as the only real Americans. This could be a future we see in every American city if we don’t stand up now.
* * *
If you’d like to donate to the legal effort against Charlottesville you may donate through www.jasonkessler.us/donate or by sending cash or check to the attorney at:
Kolenich Law Office
9435 Waterstone Blvd. #140
Cincinnati, OH 45249
You can contact Jason on social media at:
And of course, his website: JasonKessler.us.
Proud of Being Guilty: Fighting the Stigma of Lawfare in Sweden & Winning
The Oslo Incident
Making Lions out of Lambs: A Response to Max Morton of American Greatness
Culture, History, & Metapolitics in Poland: An Interview with Jaroslaw Ostrogniew, Part 2
The Worst Week Yet: March 21-27, 2021
Counter-Currents Radio Podcast No. 324 Interview with Spencer Quinn
A Cause for Hope
Counter-Currents Radio Podcast No. 311 Jason Kessler